Munster wont eat/drink after surgery - He's gone <3

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In the second video it looked to me like he was just favouring the incision, that when he was walking it was pulling the skin a bit, making it uncomfortable.
I'm so glad you were able to give him sub q fluids over the weekend. It probably made all the difference!
 
He's still hanging in there. He got 10cc's fluid this morning because I forgot to divide it into his two doses of 5cc's twice a day, but he doesn't have to come out for a poking tonight so it's probably just as well after a stressful day for him. He did continue to eat better today. He ate some vegan chicken nugget, some mashed potato/carrot, watered down yogurt/oats/green mush, and he really loves his corn. He's eating pretty decent servings each time as well. I stayed with him on the bed today but he never chose to come out, so I finally decided to give him the bottom 4th of the FN (I've got 4 shelves, so I block the cage into 4th's by putting two shelves side by side). I figure he's got more room to move around, isn't sitting in a carrier peeing and sleeping in it, and he'll be getting more familiar with the sounds and smells of the other monsters in the upper level. He'll still come out on the bed too, but I'll be able to leave him safely alone in the room with more space.

One question for those who sub-q... Do they eventually begin drinking from the bottle after they are better hydrated? I almost wondered if they wouldn't want to drink from the bottle because they are already being hydrated from the sub-q, but then wondered how you know if they'll begin drinking when you take them off? Do you wean them off, or should I be seeing him drink from the bottle soon even while sub-q'ing him?
 
Any fluid going in be it sub-q or orally with the water bottle or even moist foods will do. If he's eating well, keep the moist foods coming and lay off the sub-q. I only sub-q like this until they are back to normal...Dr Munn always says the natural way (orally) is always best.

Poor Merle, fingers crossed on those abs working!!
 
I'm just wondering what to expect as he improves with the sub-q fluid. Do they tend to eventually begin drinking out of the bottle again while being sub-q'd, or do they ignore the bottle simply because they already have enough fluids in them? I just don't know if I'm supposed to be expecting to start seeing him drinking from the bottle as he gets better, or if I just wait until he seems back to normal and then stop the sub-q's even if he isn't drinking from the bottle at all.
 
He got his sub-q today and is definitely eating more, but is still very, very wobbly trying to stand, groom, walk, etc, so I'm not sure how in the clear we are just yet. I'm still hopeful as he is eating quite a bit more now, but his wobbliness almost seemed worse today and he's still very weak. I've placed him on the bed next to me and we're just spending the morning together. So far he just wants to sleep so I've got him bundled next to me.
 
:hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs: :hugs:

oh poor ol guy! :sad3:

spend as much time as you can with him, I'm sure it's a great comfort to him.
perhaps he has a bit of early HED?

in any case, he's got a great home, good food and medical care, and the best mom ever plus all the love in the world.
we never know how long we'll have, but to make the time we have good time, that's such a blessing. you are doing that for him.
:hugs:
 
damn it. he's eating better but it looks like a definite downturn, I'm not sure how the two go together. He's been on the bed with me this morning, at two spoonfuls of oats, some banana, some corn. He's been bundled next to me for a few hours after his sub-q, but when I picked him up for his fluids today he felt more limp. He just came out of the covers now and he doesn't look good. he just took a few steps, laid down with his feet drug behind him and flattened. I just took a few videos which I'm uploading now, but he looks like a complete HED kicked in. Those back feet simply drag. You can lift them for him and there's not much effort to move them. He feels limp when I pick him up, just lays wherever you put him and it takes him a great deal of effort to take a few steps into something. I don't get it, he's eating much more, but still declining.

I'll upload videos once they upload. He got 10cc's of fluid around noon yesterday, and 5cc's at 9:30 this morning.
 
saw the videos, it actually looks like he's able to use his back legs fine but his front ones, not so much

like he's pushing himself along on his belly

it's great he's eating, but I have no clue why he's having trouble getting around

very confusing.

see what I mean about the back legs? he's using his feet to push himself
 
Here are the videos of him today. He's already had his morning sub-q, and has eating two spoonfuls of watered down oats, small pieces of banana, about 20 kernals of corn, two spoonfuls of watered down yogurt with ensure, so on one hand I would have suspected he was getting better. But this is how he now looks when he moves. He is limp when I pick him up, very little use of those back legs, completely flattened... definitely worse for mobility and appearance:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=571045202944879&set=vb.100001182124493&type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=571045932944806&set=vb.100001182124493&type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=571046556278077&set=vb.100001182124493&type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=571046872944712&set=vb.100001182124493&type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=571048052944594&set=vb.100001182124493&type=3&theater

I've called the vet for advice. While I'm willing to bring him back in, I'm also hesitant that the stress of the vet visits, shots, etc are making things worse as well so I'm hoping I'm making the right calls for him in this regard. I worry that he's already teetering and constantly taking him down to the vet might make things worse as well.
 
wow I don't know, he is actually using his back legs, I see what you mean he's not standing on them but he's using them like paddles to propel himself forward and I could see him using his front paws in one clip too
but why he is down on his belly like that.......??

makes me think he's got pain somewhere

can you send the vet the videos? he might be able to tell from those or have a better idea what might be going on
 
His tail has been cold but it's usually not tucked in with him. He's been bundled with me, and when I took the videos I did try lifting his feet to see what he would do or to help him step, and they didn't feel cold to me. He has been having the start of some wet sneezes the past few days, which I mentioned to the vet because my fear was pneumonia. He said we'd have to keep a close eye and I'd let him know if it got any worse. It doesn't seem worse, just the same to me, and I've no idea what to do if that is what this looks like.
 
I just talked to someone at the vet. She added me on facebook and got the videos and will show my vet shortly when he comes back from lunch. I told them I don't have a problem bringing him in, I'm just worried as well about stressing him so much with everything we're trying to do to save him. I keep hoping I'm finding the right balance.

Luckily, there are videos on my facebook from two days ago as well, and you can certainly see that he looked better/got around better there. I just want me vet to see his condition before we make the call to stress him with another trip for nothing.
 
that's great about the vet!! I'm anxious to know what they say

I"d already written this before you posted about the vet:
I'm only going by my limited experience but since I doubt you can give him steroids for any reason with the antibiotics and the risk of pneumonia, I'd keep him warm, love him gently and keep doing what you're doing. Unless you think he needs more antibiotics- I don't know what he's on now.

he's eating, so I think he's probably fine internally, and as for the decline in mobility, it's probably age related, but even if it's not, what more could the vet do?
keep him warm and stay optimistic and calm, as he can pick up on that from you.

I hope someone else with more experience comes along soon but in the meantime, if it were my old guy, that's what I would do.
 
I think he has some balance issues or like there's a central nervous system issue, but I'm not sure. The hind legs don't worry me too much because it's pretty common for older rats but the front legs, he seems to have trouble controlling them at one point. His eyes are half closed so he's not feeling great but he seems aware at least.
 
He is not on any antibiotics. Just the sub-q. He was on pain meds but those got discontinued when he stopped eating or drinking.

My major concern with the loss of mobility is that he had exceptional mobility before the surgery. He could simply jump up to his next level of his cage, and we were very impressed at that because of his age. He looked old and ragged, but he had an amazing jump. Even considering the fall he took off the bed Saturday, you can still see that his mobility was far less concerning Sunday's video, so it seems strange that an injury from the fall would have progressed slowly like this. What baffles me most is simply the increase in food he's eating along with the decrease in motor ability. Even yesterday he was eating less but getting around better.
 
So, just to be clear... at this point he's getting 10cc's of fluid, divided up into 5cc's twice per day. No other medications have been given, I've just been told to do the 10cc's and get him to eat as much as possible, which he seems to still be doing.

I've been giving him watered down lab blocks, watered down vegan yogurt, watered down oats, adding green mush in, corn, mashed potatoes/carrots, bread.

The only other thing I can think to give him would be ensure. If I'm overlooking anything important please let me know.

If ab's are needed I'd have to get them from the vet. If I should be trying something else I can ask as well.
 

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