jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
The nipping is not right. So she's being a bully. This might stop once they move in together and she realizes there's nothing she can do about it.
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yeah, she's escalating with the nipping (nose, cheek). never leaves a mark, but is being REALLY persistent about it. she only does it when she feels like she's in charge though.
I also forgot to mention that the tugging, etc. worried me paired with the nipping and that she does this 75% of the time during an intro. like, if they get UNDER the intro blanket together, she is likely to spend 75% of her time following him around, trying to pin him on his back, nipping, or tugging. it's very, very interesting because it gets under Sugar's skin, but he does not retaliate beyond boxing, squeaking, or avoiding her. but I know for sure it bugs him because I cannot try to pet him when she does this without him kicking (as if I was her trying to harass him).
I may have to try to get a neutral cage set up to see how a shared living situation goes.
my poor Sugar, I got 3 pairs of girls for him and either they are scared of him, won't stay on the bed/couch to do intros, or they bully him. and they're all spayed, so I can't hope for hormones to settle XD
I also forgot to mention that the tugging, etc. worried me paired with the nipping and that she does this 75% of the time during an intro. like, if they get UNDER the intro blanket together, she is likely to spend 75% of her time following him around, trying to pin him on his back, nipping, or tugging. it's very, very interesting because it gets under Sugar's skin, but he does not retaliate beyond boxing, squeaking, or avoiding her. but I know for sure it bugs him because I cannot try to pet him when she does this without him kicking (as if I was her trying to harass him).
I may have to try to get a neutral cage set up to see how a shared living situation goes.
my poor Sugar, I got 3 pairs of girls for him and either they are scared of him, won't stay on the bed/couch to do intros, or they bully him. and they're all spayed, so I can't hope for hormones to settle XD
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
Are you doing the whole gang together with your intros? 4 girls in total right? Or am I mixing that with someone else's. lol
well, I've tried to do 4 girls + Sugar, but CeeCee and Pepper figured out a few months ago how to get off the couch and bed, so now intros with them last about...2 minutes. because they refuse to acknowledge the other rats and now that they know how to get off the furniture, they are not going to wait around to deal with those pesky other rats XD my little divas <3 so it's been mostly just the 3 (Penny/Priya/Sugar) while I try to figure out how to keep the other two in the same area.
I am really, really debating making a play pen in the rat room (the only place I can get CeeCee and Pepper to acknowledge other rats, for better or worse) and trying 4 girls + Sugar. I am wondering if the large amount of new rats would intimidate Penny enough that she wouldn't start with the bullying, which she does if it's 1 on 1 or 2 on 1 (with Priya, her cage mate) intros.
I am really, really debating making a play pen in the rat room (the only place I can get CeeCee and Pepper to acknowledge other rats, for better or worse) and trying 4 girls + Sugar. I am wondering if the large amount of new rats would intimidate Penny enough that she wouldn't start with the bullying, which she does if it's 1 on 1 or 2 on 1 (with Priya, her cage mate) intros.
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
That's what I was thinking, the more the better so that Penny is either overwhelmed or feels more comfortable. I'd definitely work on that. Get that play pen up!
I think I'm going to get some cardboard within the next few days, until then keep up the intros. Sugar is SUCH a docile boy, I don't think it will bother him too much to deal with her being a bully until then.
Penny is such a hysterical rat. it doesn't surprise me in the least that she's being a bully. she's a terribly high strung and has been bit in intros before. I think she's settled in a bit more since the last time I tried intros and her solution is to be a bit of the alpha/bully. she's also enough of a wrestler that I am tempted to create her own WWF name and get her a cape/tights.
Penny is such a hysterical rat. it doesn't surprise me in the least that she's being a bully. she's a terribly high strung and has been bit in intros before. I think she's settled in a bit more since the last time I tried intros and her solution is to be a bit of the alpha/bully. she's also enough of a wrestler that I am tempted to create her own WWF name and get her a cape/tights.
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
LOL now that! I'd love to see. haha
TheoBennyWinston
Member
I have two 13 month old male rats, Benny and Winston, and I recently adopted two 5 week old males from a rescue. I kept the babies quarantined for a week and then I introduced them yesterday and today. One of the babies is EXTREMELY playful and curious about the older boys, and one of the babies is afraid of them and mostly hides, sometimes running out for a second and then hiding again. I let them play for about 15 minuets before separating them again.
Benny seems to only be interested in the babies bums. He seems to really enjoy playing with the babies, but he frequently pushes them over and licks their bums, and I don't think they like it. I think he is trying to eat their poop! Winston on the other hand, completely ignores the babies. When they go up to him, he walks away. Sometimes they go up to him, he squeaks a lot, and then goes back into his cage.
After reading this thread, I will wait 3 more weeks to introduce them fully, and I will start intro-ing them on the kitchen table instead of in the babies room, but I was wondering if it is okay for Benny to eat the poo and if Winston ignoring the babies is normal?
Benny seems to only be interested in the babies bums. He seems to really enjoy playing with the babies, but he frequently pushes them over and licks their bums, and I don't think they like it. I think he is trying to eat their poop! Winston on the other hand, completely ignores the babies. When they go up to him, he walks away. Sometimes they go up to him, he squeaks a lot, and then goes back into his cage.
After reading this thread, I will wait 3 more weeks to introduce them fully, and I will start intro-ing them on the kitchen table instead of in the babies room, but I was wondering if it is okay for Benny to eat the poo and if Winston ignoring the babies is normal?
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
Oh good. I'm happy to see that you are going to wait longer before letting them play together.
Benny is probably not eating their poop, he's sniffing their genitals and getting a sense of who they are that way but babies don't really smell like rats yet so it's probably confusing to Benny. Once the babies are 2 months old, he will identify with them and the intros should go better. As for Winston, he's displaying the desired behaviour. I would be worried that Benny at some point will hurt the babies' testicles. Males can do that in a blink of an eye when they are hormonal and stressed.
Benny is probably not eating their poop, he's sniffing their genitals and getting a sense of who they are that way but babies don't really smell like rats yet so it's probably confusing to Benny. Once the babies are 2 months old, he will identify with them and the intros should go better. As for Winston, he's displaying the desired behaviour. I would be worried that Benny at some point will hurt the babies' testicles. Males can do that in a blink of an eye when they are hormonal and stressed.
TheoBennyWinston
Member
Thank you! This is my first introduction so I appreciate the insight. Would you say that I should keep them separated completely for the next 3 weeks, or should I still do 15 minutes "get to know each other" sessions on the table? I watch them closely the whole time, but I can wait 3 more weeks if the babies would be in danger in any way. Benny and Winston are both very docile and have never shown any aggression in the 11 months that I have had them.
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
I would keep them apart until the babies are at least 8 weeks old. But I would have their cages next to each other so they can smell each other and hear/talk to each other. Rats are always sending signals in frequencies we can't hear but they do communicate.
I also welcome you to start your own thread for the intros for these guys. It will be easier when keeping a timeline.
I also welcome you to start your own thread for the intros for these guys. It will be easier when keeping a timeline.
Hey how old do my 8 week old girls have to be before I can let Bobo meet them? I let my other two girls meet them and it went super great but I'm too scare to let Bobo I heard males will kill young ones that are not their own
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
8 weeks should be good, Ace.
That is absolutely false about adult male rats killing young rats but they can be rough and lack impulse control when faced with something they are unsure of. In fact, females can also kill babies which is why we always recommend 8 weeks for intros no matter what, that is just a precaution.
People should remember that it is very uncommon for rats to kill other rats or babies. But we should take precautions for those few times that it did happen.
That is absolutely false about adult male rats killing young rats but they can be rough and lack impulse control when faced with something they are unsure of. In fact, females can also kill babies which is why we always recommend 8 weeks for intros no matter what, that is just a precaution.
People should remember that it is very uncommon for rats to kill other rats or babies. But we should take precautions for those few times that it did happen.
I recently got a really young (about 1 month) old female rat, and planned to move her in with my three (roughly one year old) rats. I've had them meet a few times, and the Alpha is giving me the biggest issue, getting into scuffles with this little baby. I haven't seen biting, but I have seen general tumbling, pinning, and a lot of...punching? From the alpha - the baby also squeaks a lot, even if just being sniffed. The baby is scared of everything, and only really wants to be around people (though she wants to explore on her own). I feel like she gets into more damage running from the alpha and hiding/crashing into things than just having the alpha go after her...but I obviously don't want any fights. I'm just having a hard time...determining.
I feel like I am rushing through the intro, but it's mainly because the baby is all alone...I don't want her to be alone so long and getting another month old rat is at this time impossible...any advice? Will the baby be okay if I slow down? She's in a small cage (the three are in the double CN cage), which could fit in the CN's one level and not even take up half the space.
Tomorrow I thought about introducing them in the bathtub with food; today they had a neutral play area (a bed) but it ended up with the baby hiding in the folds of the covers, generally being terrified of everything, while two of the adult rats did their own thing, even protecting the baby, while the alpha sought the baby out. I'm at such a loss and it's so stressful keeping the baby alone like this.
As a note, I know aggressive rats 'puff up'...however Dupin is a rex, and her fur doesn't spike, and she's the biggest of the three main rats anyway, and, as I've already mentioned in another thread, she's a bully to them (though not at all to the same degree). I don't..think I hear hissing, but I'm not quite sure what a domesticated rats' hiss sounds like...?
I feel like I am rushing through the intro, but it's mainly because the baby is all alone...I don't want her to be alone so long and getting another month old rat is at this time impossible...any advice? Will the baby be okay if I slow down? She's in a small cage (the three are in the double CN cage), which could fit in the CN's one level and not even take up half the space.
Tomorrow I thought about introducing them in the bathtub with food; today they had a neutral play area (a bed) but it ended up with the baby hiding in the folds of the covers, generally being terrified of everything, while two of the adult rats did their own thing, even protecting the baby, while the alpha sought the baby out. I'm at such a loss and it's so stressful keeping the baby alone like this.
As a note, I know aggressive rats 'puff up'...however Dupin is a rex, and her fur doesn't spike, and she's the biggest of the three main rats anyway, and, as I've already mentioned in another thread, she's a bully to them (though not at all to the same degree). I don't..think I hear hissing, but I'm not quite sure what a domesticated rats' hiss sounds like...?
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
Your baby is 4 weeks old? that is extremely young. I wouldn't introduce her to the older rats until baby is about 8 weeks old. It's too bad you didn't get another very young buddy for the baby. Babies do better in pairs. Otherwise they can get very scared. At her age, she needs to learn social skills from mom and siblings. I hate that stores sell their rats so young.
So...there's nothing I can do?
The fact we even got her was a bit of a surprise, I wasn't planning on a new rat and probably wouldn't have got her if mum hadn't named her the instant she saw her... but getting a new rat is impossible, as my father is quite adamant that we get no more pets. I'm really just at a loss...
The fact we even got her was a bit of a surprise, I wasn't planning on a new rat and probably wouldn't have got her if mum hadn't named her the instant she saw her... but getting a new rat is impossible, as my father is quite adamant that we get no more pets. I'm really just at a loss...
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
Once baby is 8 weeks old, I would start intros again. I bet it will be successful. Baby needs to stand up for herself and once she's stronger, that will will work out.
In the meantime, you can do out time with the nice girls and also spend as much time as you can with baby.
In the meantime, you can do out time with the nice girls and also spend as much time as you can with baby.
Does anyone have experience with intact and neutered male intros? I have two intact brothers that I hope to introduce to our two neutered foster boys (also probably brothers).
So far their cages have been side by side (well no, about 8 inches apart, so no one can even try to reach through the bars). The very first day one of my boys huffed and puffed for a couple minutes, but gave up after realizing that no one was listening to him or paying him any attention. Since then they havent done much of anything. They seem to be aware that the other rats are there, but pay each other no attention, and show no interest in the others.
So far their cages have been side by side (well no, about 8 inches apart, so no one can even try to reach through the bars). The very first day one of my boys huffed and puffed for a couple minutes, but gave up after realizing that no one was listening to him or paying him any attention. Since then they havent done much of anything. They seem to be aware that the other rats are there, but pay each other no attention, and show no interest in the others.
jorats
Loving rats since 2002.
You could start your own thread and we can help you out. I've done tons of intros, including intact and neutered males.
So far what you are describing sounds promising.
So far what you are describing sounds promising.
