Sophie - She's Gone :(

I just remembered that when Grace had a PT, I think she had a slightly large liver. For weeks she had been "off" and I had no idea what it was. I ruled out depression, infection, and pain before taking her to the vet. I had asked many times in chat for ideas, and the best explanation I had at the time was heart disease, but I still wasn't sure. When she started losing energy on top of being "off" I went to the vet with her and explained she was off (she hated the vet and was super lethargic when we were there, which made the issue more obvious) and told her everything I had tried prior to the visit. She also suspected heart issues (I had not told her about my suspicions because I wasn't sure and didn't want to steer her in that direction if that wasn't her issue) so we did an x-ray and there wasn't anything wrong with her heart but *I think* her liver was slightly larger that normal - not enough to cause concern but larger than expected. The vet did not think it was a contributing factor, and since we had ruled many things out, she treated for a neurological condition with Pred and Batryl.

Grace did improve at first but eventually just gave up. She never lost weight, in fact she even gained between the appointment when we took the x-ray and the follow-up appointment a week later (I was only feeding her lab block dust with veggie baby food, so I don't think that it would have made a huge difference), or fur or any of the typical symptoms I associate with PT until the very end. Her last weekend she stated having issues with her front legs stiffening up in front of her, but that was it. Thinking back, I wish I had done a necropsy because I still wonder what exactly happened to her.

The other thing I want to add is that we did not do a blood test because; a) even if we found something wrong with an organ, it was unlikely there would be much we could do and b) the blood test itself would have been pretty hard on her. Rats don't have a lot of blood to begin with, so even having .5 ml drawn would be a significant loss. Some of the current weight loss may be attributed to her body working overtime and drawing on reserves to replace the lost blood.

This sounds just like Sophie ..she still seems "off" to me even thoguh she is active when up ..and my vet was also thinking very early signs of PT.

 

[jorats]

My sister's old girl Yvette is losing weight and is sleeping a lot more than usual. Her fur is not smooth and she's lost her hind end mobility, but she's also 30 months... but I suspect PT with Yvette.

 

My sister's old girl Yvette is losing weight and is sleeping a lot more than usual. Her fur is not smooth and she's lost her hind end mobility, but she's also 30 months... but I suspect PT with Yvette.

Sophie is at the starting age for PT ...just turned 18 months old November 17th.
My vet's first thoughts were very early signs of PT ..but we won't know unless she starts showing an obvious sign.

We are checking into the dewormer ..better to try something ..rather than nothing ...

 

[crumbilina]

I think this is the reason my vet is waiting for another opion ..he dose not want to put her on meds if it will hurt her even more ...

I just reaseached tapeworms, says it can affect the liver?

Have they done a fecal on her?

Tapeworms can sometimes effect the liver considering that there are tubes from the liver leading into the GIT. I don't really know how often this would happen but I would expect this would need to be a pretty heavy infestation because they usually only hang out in the GIT. In heavy infections in other animals, you can sometimes see them coughed up in vomit or just normal everyday coughing. In other words, it seems as though if it was in the liver, you would definitly see something in her poop. Have you looked? I'm kindof a nerd - so what I would do is take a dried poop that i know was from her and crumble it up a bit and see if there is anything out of the ordinary. Also, be careful - you should use gloves - because some rat tapeworms have humans as their secondary host. Actually, if your still interested, I will look into how to do a fecal float with everyday items you have at home. I believe that I still have it in my parasitology notes (pretty bad, i know - but it was the best class ever!)

If the vet has not yet done a fecal, I would have it done.

Speaking of parasites... do you have cats? T. gondii can effect rats by making them slower and run out in the open, etc. Basically acts to make the rat easy prey (so does anything that will make the rat easier to catch). Unfortunately I have no idea how it would effect the liver of a rat - but i do know it goes into the brain and tissues of rats/mice and changes things there. This is just something to throw out there, not sure how well it matches any symptoms. I keep my cats FAR away from my rats for this reason (and others of course)

 

My vet has done a fecal already ..I am going to od another one tonight.
I do have a cat, but he lives upstairs.

 

[hopefloats]

I seen there was some that could be in the urine. so maybe that is the other way to check

 

Urine is already checked

 

[crumbilina]

This really is a h*** of a case!

(lol I was just going to make a joke about taking her to Dr. House I resrained myself, but not enough to not mention it *rolls eyes*)

Hopefully something will show up in the feces when you take a look tonight.

Wierd...

 

[hopefloats]

I am thinking house may be the only answer here.. Wow,

 

Just talking to my vet for the 100th time today, once sophie poops we have to bring it down, they will run a fecal test on it tonight.
I have her out on the couch now so I will know what poop is hers

 

[Rachael]

It doesn't sound like a PT to me.

 

So I took Sophie out at 4, it's now 8 and she hasnt pooped ....I even put her in the warm bath tub ....

 

[crumbilina]

Has she eaten? maybe give her some ensure and baby food or something that she will for sure eat?

Or do you think she is having some sort of digestive backup?

 

She has eaten a full spoon of olive oil, 3 spoons of ensure, a little bit of apple sauce, a lil bit of baby food peas, lil piece of watermelon, lil piece of strawberry and some soy milk.

She dosent look backed up nor dose she feel bloated.

I figured warm water would make her poop but it never

Yesterday and the day before she was pooping ..but it looked painful ..

Is there anything I can do to help her poop??

 

[crumbilina]

sorry, i have no idea what to do to make her poop.

When you touch her belly does she respond like she is in pain?

 

No she don't.

 

[crumbilina]

wierd.... I have no idea.

I've suggested all that I can think of. Wow, this really is confusing...

 

confusing is not the word

Doing the stool sample test tomorrow, if nothing comes back from it ..she will go on pred and baytril :cry4:

 

[crumbilina]

Confusing is the word for me... I'm sure you have a bazillion other words that you would rather use that are far more appropriate.

Good Luck with your little girlie! Best wishes!

 

[Rachael]

This might sound a bit weird, but when Monkey didn't poop all day we had to try massage her stomach a bit and then we put her in some water and that worked and got things moving a bit.