Mentally challenged baby rat??

[spazzytazzy]

Hey everyone, just wondering if it is possible for a rat to be born mentally handicapped in the same way that humans can be? My girl Higgs had 6 beautiful baby dumbos, and at around 15 days old (just after opening their eyes) I realized that one boy is very different. He is 7 weeks old now and doing great, but with the mentality and physical development of a much younger rat. He is literally 2.5 x smaller than his siblings, and has a more mousy looking face than the others (no swelling of head or eyes or drainage etc) but in otherwise good health. He is very hyper (he really only stops moving when he sleeps or grooms himself) so I'm pretty sure he has adhd. He does a lot of spins and he is slightly off balance when he walks. "Taz" eats and drinks very well, and loves life (he's always happy). He responds to my voice and is very attached to me, gets along with his brothers and dad, and climbs around the bars of his cage a lot. Nothing has really changed in his behaviour. No seizures. When he first opened his eyes it took him a while (maybe a week or two, longer?) before he fully opened his eyes beyond 3/4s of the way open. I thought he was blind or deaf or even poor visioned at first but then realized that he just has trouble concentrating on one thing and staying still. He is also starting to act more mature only in the sense that he lets out a drop of urine on contact with skin (like my boys did when they reached maturity). I'm very curious as to what this may be (and hope it's nothing serious like a PT)!
I was in contact with rathelp.com for a while and they seem perplexed by him as well. They thought maybe he had hydrocephalous but ruled that out, then they suggested that he may have had some trauma during birth (which is likely since it was Higg's first litter and I thought I seen a scab on one of the babies' heads the first day but it was completely gone the second day). So yea I'm confused! I personally think he's just very special maybe with a form of autism (if that's possible) and/or something else too.
Please let me know if you have heard of a rat being born like this

Thanks,
Ashley

 

[eagle]

I am very sorry to hear this. Can you possibly get a video of Taz in action. I had an oops litter born her in July and one of the girls was a runt. Sadly she passed away in September while at her foster home. She was more of a failure to thrive baby girl.

 

[SQ]

If he spins a lot, is it possible that he has an inner ear infection?
Does he always spin in the same direction?

Rats can certainly have different levels of intelligence, brain damange, etc.
Since he has difficultly focusing on more then one activity and is hyper, you likely need to pay attention to whether he is getting enough nutrition.
ADHD etc in people is greatly influenced by diet, additives in the diet etc.

What does your vet think?

 

[EDK]

Never heard of this before, but I hope its not a physical problem or mental, he may just be a special boy like you said. But I'm no expert, just a friendly opinion

 

[temblabamomo]

I'm no expert either, but the fact that he's made it to 7 weeks is encouraging. The spinning/circling is worrisome. Between that and his slow development, I wonder if there is some sort of neuro issue.

 

[lilspaz68]

I also would like to see a video, or at least pics...I had a hydro baby here and there's mild hydro as well.

 

[Joanne]

I too would like to see a video. I don't think there is a high incidence of mental or neurological issues in rats, as they would quickly get eaten in the wild and therefore wouldn't reproduce.

 

[spazzytazzy]

Hey everyone,
thanks for the replies! Taz does both left and right spins (i thought of the inner ear infection too). he does a lot of nodding up and down with his head as if trying to get a better look at things as well. I had been watching the babies since day one to make sure each of them had enough milk from mom, and then once I noticed that Taz was different, I made sure that he ate enough and received enough nutrition daily. He had a great latch with mom (he was usually the last one to fall off lol) and he is always the first one now to the food. I feed him fresh fruits and veggies, some dog food here and there for protein, rat mix from petsmart (with seeds, nuts, pellets etc), and the occasional treat of something like dried fruit or a cracker etc
here is a link to a video of him (it's not the best quality because I literally took it ten mins ago and uploaded it to show an up-to-date video of him). The other rat that appears briefly in the video is his mom (I only have her out with him because he is way too busy doing his own thing lol). Right now he is actually sitting pretty still on my shoulder clicking away.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_i8Jdem ... e=youtu.be

 

[spazzytazzy]

here is a video of him when he was 3 weeks old (he hasn't grown much since then)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXmzqMTCNeY

 

[victoria]

Sadly, that is not an ear infection.

I don't have any experience with it but it does look like he has hydrocephalus. He seems happy for the time being at least. Lilspaz68 has some experience with hydro babies, I'm sure she'll be able to give you more info in the morning.

Here's some info for you: http://ratguide.com/health/neurological ... phalus.php

 

[Fidget]

Wow. It looks like his head moves around a whole lot when you're holding him but not so much when he's running around.
I was blessed to get Basil because his adopters were worried that he had something contagious to their kid because of his weird movements, he held his head up at an odd angle, circled sometimes and was very hyper. He didn't act exactly like your kid, but I see parallels.
I was all over the net looking for answers, but the vet said it was a balance problem due to oxygen deprivation at birth. I'm pretty certain your boy has the same thing. It didn't affect Basil or bother him other than odd movements, he got better balance over time with practice. He lived 25 1/2 mo's and was a normal happy boy, and extremely trusting & loving!
I wouldn't have considered him mentally challenged at all, not the brightest light in the ceiling, but he was not stupid by any means. I expect that with oxygen deprivation the amout of time deprived will affect the kid's differences. But no problem at all if that's what going on with your boy, he's happy & healthy!

 

[EDK]

Wow what an odd but adorable little fella! I would agree with Fidget in that he looks happy and healthy despite and defiently loves you his human mommy alot! I could care less about his movement he's just cute! I do hope its just a small little birth defect and he'll over come it as he gets older. Hopefully Lilspaz will shed some light better for you too when she sees this. But at least he looks happy and healthy despite his movement!

 

[spazzytazzy]

thank you! i really hope it's not hydrocephalous because of the unlikelihood of treating it without a stent the one thing i can say is that his head never seemed to be swollen (and always looked the same as his siblings); i just noticed (around the time that his fur grew in) that his face just seems slightly different? if it was hydo would he have a swollen head by now or does it take a few months to show? i think oxygen deprivation would be likely too since it can explain some of his symptoms (hopefully that's the only thing wrong). I really really don't want him to die early! he's such a sweet happy boy and I'm so attached to him. he literally makes every day that much better for me <3
and im happy he doesn't seem to be in pain, and that he always seems to be happy and clicking lol i cant really find much else on the internet that might explain him

 

[victoria]

I think with mild hydro the deformities are less pronounced. The fact his head/fave look different is a dead giveaway. I think it's very unlikely that his issues are due to oxygen deprivation at birth and if so, it will worsen with age as well.

Here is Junebug's thread, she was a hydro baby with other serious issues that was rescued by Lilspaz68 earlier this year. As you can see, her deformities were not as pronounced as the figures on Rat Guide but she didn't look normal either: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=30205

 

[spazzytazzy]

so there for sure is no such thing as other deformities for baby rats? they cant have physical or mental handicaps from toxins or chromosome issues (like downsyndrome, where there are visible facial differences) or anything else that might explain him? i really just want some hope that he doesnt/wont have significant incurable intracranial pressure leading to his early death! there cant be any genetic deformities like this in rats?

 

[hopefloats]

I havent seen anything like that in rats other than the hydro babies that I have heard about on here. We see a lot of rats come through here. He is to young for a tumor,, ear infections do not make them act that way, and there isnt a whole lot of other things that to either.

Enjoy him however long he is with you. Dont nail his coffin yet, he looks full of energy. You never know how long any rat will be around.

 

[victoria]

so there for sure is no such thing as other deformities for baby rats? they cant have physical or mental handicaps from toxins or chromosome issues (like downsyndrome, where there are visible facial differences) or anything else that might explain him? i really just want some hope that he doesnt/wont have significant incurable intracranial pressure leading to his early death! there cant be any genetic deformities like this in rats?

I just did a brief search and every reference I could find to a facial/cranial deformity in rats was hydrocephalus. I don't think there is a rat equivalent of Down's syndrome. Of course anything is possible but I would say it's extremely likely that it is hydrocephalus. The behaviour matches as well. I think the alternative would be even worse, because you wouldn't know what to do to relieve symptoms and the tests required to figure out what is wrong would be incredibly prohibitive.

Hydro isn't common in rats but it's not unheard of. You should look around your area for a good exotic vet or one that is experienced with rats and consult them about different treatments. Rat Guide's figures are a good place to start because they give you an idea of what has been tried before - it's likely most vets have never seen this in a rat. It may be that a vet has an idea for a treatment not listed on Rat Guide, that's not necessarily a bad thing either. You should post on multiple forums asking for others' experiences - Goose Moose Rats Rule and Brux and Boggle are two other large forums with very knowledgeable people, there are others I'm sure. (Stay away from Rat Forum, it's a waste of time.)

 

[lilspaz68]

He does look like a hydro lad, BUT don't think its an automatic death sentence. Some hydro babies make it and grow into older rats. It seems that 7 weeks f(form my research) seems to be a time when they might pass on, they will slow down a lot then sleep then pass. He might ahve a buildup of fluid in his brain, but he'[s also got it slowly seeping out rather than building up. Rats can actually grow out of it to an extent as well.

I would love to see him eat out of a dish, that would really confirm what is going on with him. Do you mind taking another video of him eating either soft foods or a harder item in his paws? He *may* not have hydro, but there's definitely something neurological going on, and I think to be safe, enjoy every single day of this special boy but do not expect miracles. :heart:

 

[spazzytazzy]

thank you, i will pass this along to other rat foroms as well to see what they think.
i will take a video of him eating once i get home tonight, but to give you a picture of what happens before then:
he is always able to grasp and hold hard food with his hands to eat, and sits on/balances on his back legs while eating (similar to my other rats). he also has no trouble fighting for his share of food too lol for a little guy he's not afraid to get in there and push the others out of the way and run with his food lol i love him so much <3

 

[EDK]

He really is a special boy from what you mentioned :giggle: its always the small ones that seem to have the most spunk right? lol but in this case not only is he small but he is a bit of a handicapp that makes him do more in his personality and his love for you! I hope to see more videos of him grow, I believe he'll be ok after seeing him having a blast in your last vids!