Rat Mills

[minnow]

That made me physically ill to look at. Abuse warning, maybe? Please?

 

[daisylynn]

I've come to the conclusion that these aren't humans. These are monsters.

 

[xxchelle]

I've come to the conclusion that these aren't humans. These are monsters.

I'm sure it's been said before in this thread, but this is a GOOD rat mill. Imagine the bad ones.

This is what you support when you buy pet store rats.

 

[daisylynn]

I've come to the conclusion that these aren't humans. These are monsters.

I'm sure it's been said before in this thread, but this is a GOOD rat mill. Imagine the bad ones.

This is what you support when you buy pet store rats.

I'm talking about the video somewhere in the middle of this thread.... They forced bunnies to mate and they intentionally kill or torture animals on a daily basis..... :cry: :cry:
That makes me embarrassed to be human

 

[Ichigo]

That video was disturbing Horrible! My two oldest rats are probably from a pet mill in Sweeden, they are from a pet store, but I adopted them from a private person. I think it is just disgusting that HUMANS do this. They say that HUMANS are special because they can feel compasion and know what is moraly right and wrong. This is wrong. And these people are not humans.
https://secure.peta.org/site/Advocacy?c ... on&id=1133

 

[KaraY]

As terrible as rat mills (or any pet mills for that matter) can be, I think it's important to recognize that PETA is a very radical group who tends to go and seek out the 1 in a million most terrible pet mills / pet store conditions. I am not for either mills or pet stores, I just wanted to remind y'all to keep in mind that they do tend to exagerate the problem. Their content should be viewed with the insight that they are indeed an 'extremist' group.

 

[KaraY]

As terrible as rat mills (or any pet mills for that matter) can be, I think it's important to recognize that PETA is a very radical group who tends to go and seek out the 1 in a million most terrible pet mills / pet store conditions. I am not for either mills or pet stores, I just wanted to remind y'all to keep in mind that they do tend to exagerate the problem. Their content should be viewed with the insight that they are indeed an 'extremist' group.

* as an added note, the pertsmart in Ottawa in Merivale (the end near the costco) all the pets come from oopsie litters or the humane society..just for any of the Ottawa dwellers here. All the other petsmarts I know of it the Ottawa area are not as humane.*

 

[Bamboo]

As terrible as rat mills (or any pet mills for that matter) can be, I think it's important to recognize that PETA is a very radical group who tends to go and seek out the 1 in a million most terrible pet mills / pet store conditions. I am not for either mills or pet stores, I just wanted to remind y'all to keep in mind that they do tend to exagerate the problem. Their content should be viewed with the insight that they are indeed an 'extremist' group.

I agree 100%!! PETA are extremists and hypocrites. I love all animals too, and I hate to see bad things happen to them but firebombing medical research lab, attacking people who are wearing fur and threatening the lives of their rival's children is NOT the way to ensure that animals are treated humanely!

 

[jorats]

Regardless of PETAs activities... Horrid rat mills exists.

 

[Bamboo]

Regardless of PETAs activities... Horrid rat mills exists.

Oh no! I'm not disagreeing with that at all. Mills in general are a disgusting testament to human greed. All I'm saying is that everything PETA says should be taken with a grain of salt. They only show the worst of the worst and then label it as common. For example, the above link goes to a page where a PETA undercover opperative goes to a "Typical" feeder supplier. I personally have visited several feeder breeders and none of them have been like that. That is disgusting mill operating purely for profit. But what I'm saying is that for all we know, PETA went to 15 feeder breeders before going to that one and didn't find any cruelty. Then they find this one bad one and label it "Typical Feeder Rodent Conditions" in an attempt to enrage and disgust people against feeders in general.

 

[Storyseeker]

Hi all. Newbie to the forum, here. Oh man, don't get me started on PETA with my first non welcome-thread post. I could rant for a week about their hypocrisy. Give me ASPCA or other legitimate animal organizations any day.

I have long been aware of the importance of only going through a reputable breeder or rescue to obtain a pet dog or cat. I'll be honest though, I'd never given much thought to the plight of rodents and other exotics in the pet store industry beyond whether they were obtained legally and not harvested wild.

I'm currently awaiting my first pair of rats from a private breeder. This is a choice I made because I both didn't want to contribute to the problem of poor health and temperament caused by mass pet and feeder breeders, and also because this is my first experience with pet rats, and I wanted better odds of it being a good experience. Not so much that I was concerned about contributing to mill conditions were I to purchase from a pet store.

Going a step further though, something I was completely unaware of was the obvious connection between purchasing /any/ pet products from a pet store and the perpetuation of mill conditions.

I'm glad to have read this article. Thank you for sharing it!

 

[puffnstuff]

I have long been aware of the importance of only going through a reputable breeder or rescue to obtain a pet dog or cat. I'll be honest though, I'd never given much thought to the plight of rodents and other exotics in the pet store industry beyond whether they were obtained legally and not harvested wild.

This, unfortunately, is the common way of thinking for most of the population. We hear about dogs and cats being "rescued" from horrible conditions all the time. But you'd think there would be laws in place specifically to cover this sort of thing. I have reported several cases of backyard breeding in deplorable conditions, only to be told that there are no by-laws covering this, and unless you have evidence of physical cruelty (i.e. torturing, beating, etc), then the Humane Society and/or the local city by-law offices will not do a thing.

I'm pretty sure that if we submitted photos of hundreds of puppies being kept in a backyard shed living in their own excrement and not having water, and being sold off with various health problems, somebody would investigate. But with rodents and other exotic pets, the industry doesn't seem to care. They just don't see it as a problem. I've spoken to somebody at Humane Society, and they have told me that because there are no by-laws against breeding rats, or how many you can have, or what conditions they must live in, there's nothing HS can do, unless the owner is physically abusing the animals.

IMO letting 6 week old baby rats get pregnant and give birth, just so you can make a profit....and letting these animals live in squallor....THAT IS ABUSE.

The by-laws need to change. If you're not allowed to have more than 3 dogs in your household, why is it ok to have 400 rats in your garden shed or basement? Maybe it's about the money....maybe if we complained to Revenue Canada, somebody would poke their nose into it. After all, these backyard breeders are running a business with no business license, pocketing the money, not remitting any sales taxes, and not paying any income tax. I'm not permitted to open a business in my home without jumping through all the hoops, so why is it when we find a backyard breeder who's breeding and selling rats for feeders and/or pets, nobody of authority wants to bother about it? If it was dogs or cats, they'd jump all over it. We need to change the rules to apply to ALL animals.

 

[mccauleywent 73005]

I love the fact that this forum can have an 11 page thread on something as heated as rat mills and not have the thread locked which is something i cannot say for the other forum i belong to.

i agree that if there is such a negative feedback on the pictures shown in this thread, that many people are extremely jaded as to where these pet store rats come from. that is an exceptionally nice mill, and if you want to see some more "true to the mill standard" pics you should click on the link that was already posted that is --GRAPHIC!! http://pawofjustice.org/index.php?cat=11

if one can NOT look at those pictures and think that that is HORRIBLY wrong, then they can with a clear conscious continue to support pet stores. if not, the only place to get rats is from a rescue, oops litter, or breeder. there is no way you can justify obtaining a pet from a pet store supplied by mills. as it is so eloquently put " stop the demand... end the supply"

i hope to find many more intriguing and informative threads on this site =)

 

[Rachael]

Please put a warning on your post. A lot of members are going to click that and see the dead rats and be very upset.

 

[jorats]

The link has already been posted before and she warns that the link is of a worse rats mill so I think people know it's "enter at your own risk".

Please put a warning on your post. A lot of members are going to click that and see the dead rats and be very upset.

 

[mccauleywent 73005]

oo..o yeah sorry, i figured since it was already in the thread, and i was just referring to the link.. ill put a warning next time.. as soon as i figure out how to put a warning im new, and this is quite different from the other forum im a member of

 

[minnow]

It should just work to put a note before the link that the images are very graphic and not for soft hearts or weak stomachs. Just text.

 

[Ichigo]

What bothers me though, is that it is the same pictures that are used in every similar thread about these rat mills. So it's really about THAT rat mill. Have people visited other rat mills? Others who supply pet stores with rats? They can't all be bad, can they?

And most important. HOW do we stop this? Did the pet mill get into trouble for doing this? What can we, as caring human beings, do to stop this?

Perhaps inform the masses? Go through the medias and make them cover these stories so that the world gets to see these horrible things? I don't know, but someone has to! Is it okey to sit there by your computer and be angry for seeing a picture of a dead rat and then post it in a thread on a ratforum on the gigantic internett where very few will even see your reaction? I don't think that will help these animals really. There would be far less homeless rescues if these mills were illegal!

Lots of questionmarks there... And perhaps idealistic ideas, but if someone can answer I would really apreciate it!

 

[jorats]

Personally, I've reached more people with this forum than I ever could in my own city. I reach the people that are willing to learn and understand. I can't even count how many members here no longer support pet stores anymore because of us being in front of our computers, educating people.
I know that in Toronto there is always a rally going on for one type of thing or another against pet stores. Big cities have more people and they can do more. Little towns like mine, all we can do is talk to those that ask and those that want to listen. Every day there's an opportunity be it on your computer or in front of the store entrance.

 

[Moon]

First and foremost, to change anything, rats have to be recognized as "animals" and be protected under the animal welfare laws. As of 2000, mice, rats and birds (domestic) were all exempt from the USDA's animal welfare act so they could all be used as laboratories and researchers saw fit and they were not required to keep records on those animals as they are with larger ones. Steps were being taken to change that but as far as I can find, those changes were fought heavily by researchers and they never went through.

I can not find specific information about the rights of rats and mice in Canada.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... ntent;col1
http://www.aphis.usda.gov/animal_welfar ... licreg.pdf