rats living outside?? UPDATE: page 3

[sketchi]

well I finally moved back home after school ended, and my mom does not like the smell of rat. she makes me put the CN outside, on our balcony. I take the rats in at night, but then they have to go in a small cage. the CN has to stay outside. ): for a while the CN was inside and I changed the fleece once a week, but apparently she said it still stunk up the place (I didn't smell anything. o__o) and it's always outside now. when it rains I have to keep them in a small cage inside.

I can't even put down fleece anymore since bugs will appear, even within a day. it just has to be bare, and then wiped down every night. she points to the bugs and claims 'see how dirty they are!' etc about the rats' poop and pee, but seriously!! it's because it's outside!!!! :gaah: when they were inside I never had a problem with bugs.


is it even safe for the rats to be left outside all day? they seem dirtier than before, oilier. I wipe them down with damp toilet paper every now and then, whereas before they seemed clean enough without before that. I can't wait to move out so I can keep the rats INSIDE always, but I don't see how that's possible within the next couple months. it'll be at least a year before I move out, and this situation seems less than ideal for the rats.

advice? ):

 

[sketchi]

(oh yeah, they're pretty safe from the elements--there's a cardboard roof over the cage, and lots of hidey places in the cage. I probably could put them outside when it rains but the bottom front pan of the CN does get wet, and I wouldn't want them rolling around in dirty rain water)

it's mostly the bugs I'm worried about, and outside diseases, and maybe even rabid squirrels or something. ahhhhgg. and also the staying-inside-a-tiny-cage-every-night thing.

 

[LA]

Domestic rats are not made to be outside, ESPECIALLY in a cage. Heat, rain, bugs, they don't handle the change in temp very well at all. It's not good for them. If it gets cold outside and no one is home to bring them in they could get VERY sick. They may be out of the sun but not the temperatures.

Air purifiers might help, I have an arm and hammer one that is excellent. They simply cannot be left outside.

 

[sketchi]

fffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
I want to move. x___________x my mom is convinced we'll get some sort of rat sickness from their poop and pee etc. I'm sooooo arARRGGGG. then should I keep them in a tinier cage inside?!?! I can attach a few cages together so they have more of a mazey home, but it won't be nearly as big as the CN.


air purifiers?? I'll look into that! thanks

 

[xxchelle]

This is NOT good at all. Rats are not okay outside, they will DIE in this weather, ESPECIALLY the heat, they have to be inside. Either convince your mom to let them be in the house, move out now, or give your rats to someone who could keep them inside. If your only option is the last one I want to take Milky back, and I'll take all three.

This needs to be done NOW, those poor rats are not sheltered from the heat at all, despite being in shade they're still outside (think of how hot it was last week, even in the shade).

Also, fleece needs to be changed at LEAST twice a week to keep the smell down.

 

[LA]

How small is the other cage? What type, size? how many rats?

 

[eagle]

I agree with what everyone else has said, they cannot live outside. They will DIE in the heat.

 

[sketchi]

3 rats, it's one of those "my first pet" type cages. it had two stories but I took the level out, so it's higher than a normal cage but still pretty small. I also have a one-level cage that's slightly bigger, and I can attach those two together so they can stretch a bit.

when I changed the fleece once a week I never smelled anything, but maybe I'm used to the smell. ok chelle, I'll definitely keep that in mind. my parents aren't home so I can't talk to her, but I'll see if I can tonight. I would rather move out than give away my rats, so we'll see how this goes.


I will go take them in now... >___<

 

[sketchi]

oh yeah, just for reference--are there any (horrible, fatal) diseases humans can get from DOMESTIC pet rats? ANY at all? I don't think so but my mom is convinced otherwise. I know certain mites is a possibility but quite preventable. are there any special bacteria lurking in rat poop/pee that just can't wait to infect a human? is there something innately dirty about rats that will transfer to humans?

u_____u

 

[LA]

None!

 

[eagle]

Ok the only disease and it is very very rare is rat bite fever. Chances of getting that are slim and none. Mites/lice will not go from rat to human so no issue there. Ringworm would be a possibilty but the rat gets that from the human not the other way around. Fleas will not be an issue unless they catch them from a cat. Domestic rats do not carry the deadly plague. :wink2:

 

[puffnstuff]

Rats are very clean animals. They have a bad reputation from the olden times, but domesticated rats do not carry any diseases.

If your Mom smells the rats, it's because their cage is not being cleaned out enough. If you really want to keep your rats, you need to clean up after them once or twice a day. Any fleece will get peed on, and that will smell. Fleece needs to be changed out daily. All other surfaces need to be wiped clean (I use a paper towel with water/vinegar) every morning and evening. Any poop should also be removed daily. Weekly, the cage should be taken outside and given a good hose down to clean off any pee that may be on the bars or dried up in nooks and crannys. If you keep the cage super clean every day, there won't be a smell. As soon as you start to neglect this responsibility, the smell will return.

You may be immune to the smell, but others like your Mom can smell it. If there is a smell, it means the cage isn't clean. These smells will also affect the rats' health, as the fumes from the old pee can cause respiratory illness.

Keeping them outside will definitely make them sick and they will die. They cannot stay outside.

 

[lilspaz68]

People have modified FN's and CN's so they can use bedding instead of fleece.

Or buy a tray from Flower Town and use something like Yesterday's News or Mews Print as your bedding

http://www.chinchilla.ca/items.php?Prod ... urce=acces

 

Personaly I would not keep them outside all day.
I have a FN and I have bedding in there instead of fleece. I cut coroplast and put on the bottom sides of the cage so the litter dose not get flicked out.
I also use YN, absorbs really well, and I also use litter pans which are dumped daily.
I get no smell what so ever.
I would imagine that moving them from inside to outside everyday could get stressful.

 

[Sorraia]

Like everyone else said, they need to be inside. Wild rats are used to being outside, and have the option of seeking appropriate shelter. Domestic rats in a cage do not have that option, they are stuck where the cage is. Even if you think the temperature isn't that bad outside, and they are in the shade, they may not feel the same way. Rats are more sensitive to heat than they are to cold. At only 24C rats are going to start feeling uncomfortable. The higher temperature rises above that point, the more uncomfortable the rats are going to feel, to the point of suffering from heat stroke (even in the shade with water).

If their cage smells, it needs to be cleaned out more often. Fleece is not the most absorbent material, and should probably be cleaned every other day, not once a week. If you have to, clean the cage out EVERY day if it means your rats can stay inside.

There are a few diseases that can be passed from domestic rats to humans, HOWEVER those diseases are excessively rare that the chances of contracting it (the chances of the rat even carrying it) is basically none. Domestic rats are more likely to carry zoonotic disease if exposed to wild animals (which they are being exposed to by being outside). These diseases are still rare however. They are more likely to contract a non-zoonotic disease (one that will infect them only and cannot be passed to humans or other species) from any wild animals they are exposed to.

 

[sketchi]

^thanks for the info on diseases. I thought that was the case already, but helps to have confirmation from more people.

ratty momma: ooh that's a very cool setup! I didn't want to do that before since it wastes a lot of bedding, but better than wasting fleece. back when I lived in my own place, I washed the bedding in the public washing machines. but my mom doesn't want me to wash the fleece in our own washing machines, and I can't hand-wash the huge thing very cleanly. ): how do you guys do it?? (here, I was using the fleece for a week and then replacing it completely. which was quite a waste)

I had no idea a smell = not clean. I just thought it was a ratty smell, like the smell of dog or something. I actually kind of like it, in small amounts. :x they all smell different, too. if it effects their health then I will probably switch to bedding instead of fleece, since I can't launder fleece here. (how often do you change the bedding?)


I think I've got a deal now! still have to talk with mom but dad says I could renovate the laundry room so the CN can be inside. I have to move a lot of stuff though, but should be able to get everything ready before the end of the week.

where do you buy Yesterday's News/Mews Print? I can only get Carefresh it seems.

 

[victoria]

I agree with what everyone's said - the heat is dangerous for any animal right now, especially a small one. You also have to think of the winter and the fact they would not survive the cold if they had to be on the balcony. I try to avoid even having to take public transport to the vet in extreme weather because of the risks from exposure. Additionally, exposure to direct sunlight is bad for your rats' eyesight (the risk of cataracts is even more elevated due to the depletion of the ozone layer) and I can't imagine that exposure to smog and car exhaust is good for their respiratory system.

I'm not sure how if you have a single or double CN, but I have 7 rats in a double and I am finding lately that changing all the fleece every other day is not enough. I change the cubes and hammocks they use most each day but even then, when I get a whiff of the fleece on cleaning day, it's gross. In the long run, changing the bedding more frequently will likely save you money because you'll avoid/delay vet visits for respiratory illnesses. As suggested, you can make reasonably cheap pans for the CN with coroplast and use a disposable bedding or there's also the option of using towels. (You would still need to change towels at least 2x a week.) I understand that because they are more absorbent they do a better job of controlling odours. With towels, you have to check them regularly for lose threads and cut them or replace the towels when they appear.

An air purifier will likely help as well, just make sure you get a good quality one. Depending on the size of your room you can get a decent one from Honeywell from Canadian Tire for $100-$300 that has a permanent HEPA filter. The air purifier will also filter out some of the dust in the air which will make keeping your room clean easier

If that fails with your mom and you can't find a compromise where you keep your rats inside full time, you have to decide what lengths you will go to to keep them. It may come down to you having to choose between moving out or rehoming your rats. It's a hard choice but your boys should not live outside, even half time.

 

[rodentmama]

My kids complained about rat blankies inthe regular laundry (my middle boy is a princess). Now I put the dirty ones in a big shopping bag and tie it to keep the smell inside. Then when I do the laundry for the rats I put in regularly detergent but also an enzyme cleaner or Orange A Peel which takes away the stink completely and disinfects. Be sure to shake the blankets outside so poop, bones and kibbles aren't in the washer.

Your mom can catch any disease you are carrying and could only rarely contract something from the rats. YOU are more of a disease risk to her then your pets.

 

Yesterdays news can be found at walmart, for cheap compared to most litters. None gets wasted if you use the coroplast around the edges.
I currently have 6 rat's in my double FN and the YN's last 1 1/2 weeks before I need to change it. Having them litter trained helps alot too.
I change the hammocks every day or second day.
I change the towels on the levels every day.
I use unscented, hypoallergenic baby wipes for wiping down the cage daily.
I don't get any smell at all from them.

When I used fleece, it would smell 1 hour into them being in the cage, it was gross.

 

[Maple]

If your not moving out within the next year, what will you do with them over the winter months? Also, not to scare you or anything but, I keep my rats in a bedroom and about 5 years ago, I went to tend to them and could hear this really funny noise. I walked over to the window to check it out and on my window sill was a barn owl. Had I not been there at that very moment, that rodent predator would have came right through my screen and killed my ratties. I have not opened their window since and when I open other windows in the house, I shut their door. I do have a wildlife center near me which could be the reason for the owl but this just goes to show you, strange things can happen.
Good luck, I hope you can come up with something soon.