hard lump in the belly - another super update! 3/17

[Joanne]

Although I am very pro-surgery, I don't know if I would in this situation. What else could it be?
I had a ferret that had an enlarged spleen. When they did the surgery, they did a biopsy of another organ (liver?) and discovered that she had leukemia. She barely had time to recover from her surgery before she got really sick and died. I wish that she hadn't have had to spend the last few weeks of her life with a sore belly. But, had we not done the surgery, we might not have discovered the problem....but in the end it wouldn't have made a difference.
You're in a rough spot - what ever decision you make will be the right one.

 

[coreline]

exactly Joanne! I'm very much pro surgery myself. I've pretty much always done surgery unless it just didn't make sense due to the diagnosis. in this case, I'm not convinced it makes sense.

as much as I'd like for him to go in and have it be that small percent that is actually an abscess, I just don't believe it is. if it's so huge and lumpy, it pretty much just screams tumor.

I've been through surgery with a rat with cancer and I am not sure it's worth the risk with it this advanced. with my previous rat, he had what we thought was a facial abscess as x-rays hadn't indicated bone involvement. but when they went in it turned out a plate near the eye had been eaten through and there may have been brain involvement. he didn't make it through recovery. just too much blood loss in the surgery. basically, aggressive cancer surgeries can be so risky. even if they seem healthy =/

I'd like her to be able to spend her last days, weeks, months, whatever it is with her rat ladies. she'd be miserable separated from them again. if they go in and can't remove anything, she could potentially spend her last bit of time in recovery.

and thank you guys for the kind words <3 this is seriously devastating. my poor girl is only just over a year. she'll only have been home a year at the end of this month.

 

[coreline]

well, Blue is doing amazing still today.

she's actually been getting more and more energetic as the week as gone by.

I am secretly crossing my fingers and toes hoping the baytril is doing something. though I know my vet is probably right that it's more likely a respiratory infection or secondary infection clearing up.

I've got to weight her later, to make sure she's not losing weight. she's been taking cheerios like crazy though.

 

[Joanne]

Great to hear!

 

[mamarat]

Hope she has even better days ahead.

 

[coreline]

so, delayed update on this because it's been a long weekend. I lost my old, sick boy, so have been too distracted to post

Blue actually got a timid thumbs up on Friday during a recheck. the vet felt that it was less bulky and MAYBE slightly smaller. he no longer was convinced that it was a guaranteed group of lumpy masses. he thinks now that it's more movable and may be a single mass with 1 connection.

problem is that we don't know if the baytril is reducing an abscess size or is reducing inflammation from a secondary infection. so we're reconsidering surgery since it doesn't seem to be aggressive cancer at least. if it was aggressive, I'm not big on flat out doing surgery in every case. I've all ready gone through 2 surgeries previously with cancer and it's so...bleh. it varies so much case to case.

it's still going to be risky and now it's 2 weeks before the Holidays and my vet can't get me in until Monday...4 days before I may leave town for a day or two and the vet is closed for 3 days. not sure I want to do such a risky surgery with only 4 days before that :|

 

[SQ]

When my rats have had lumps in their belly's they have been usually aggressive tumours attached to organs so surgery would not have helped.

At present Jubilee has a lump in her chest noticeable only on xray.
She is on baytril, chloramplhenicol palmitate, and predisone. The lump has shrunk and she is doing very well.

 

[coreline]

with your rats, how fast did the tumors grow?

my experience with aggressive cancer is facial (both surgeries were on facial tumors. though one appeared to be an abscess on xray, but turned out to be potentially a tumor that spread to the brain or originated from the brain. that one was just awful ), but the tumors grew pretty fast. 2.5 weeks was enough time to see a significant change.

part of the dilemma is that we're no longer sure it's aggressive. 2.5 week with no growth, just potential shrinking kind of starts working against it being aggressive. BUT things could change at any moment. the baytril may just be holding off a secondary infection and the tumor could just get going. I dunno.

I remember with one of my boys who had facial cancer, it was 2 months of an ear infection. then his ear drum ruptured (omg, that was so scary) and the tumor began to grow rapidly from there. we did surgery when the skin opened up, thought it was an abscess. but then the tumor began to be more apparent (thankfully not exposed).

I don't know. this is such a hard choice. blurgh!


I am so glad Jubilee is doing well! do they have any idea what the lump is?

hmm. maybe I will ask about pred when I speak to my vet today.

 

[coreline]

I'm probably going to post in this thread a billion times lol.

we've officially decided to hold off on surgery until we get more evidence that tips towards an abscess instead of cancer. the recovery rates are just too low to make me feel comfortable risking surgery

she is doing SO well right now. whatever is wrong must have been going on for awhile. she's still very laid back, but she's so much more bouncy than before! it's like when I first brought her home. she's always been so quiet, it wasn't a noticeable difference really. but she's definitely feeling better from something! she can't jump horribly well anymore due to her shoulder, but she loves running around wherever I put her lol. she has her own personal elevator with me

I'm hoping we have at least a couple more good weeks like this she's so happy right now.

 

[jorats]

My mom's rat had an abdominal tumour and it took a very long time before it was clear the rat was in pain... so you just never know. You might have a few months even.
((hugs))

 

[coreline]

that's what we're hoping for! I think if it was aggressive, fast growing cancer she'd likely be showing a lot of symptoms by now or soon. that's my guess based on how fast the facial stuff went with my other rats (and they clearly had aggressive cancer). she's going in for another recheck tomorrow if it's still shrinking that's a good sign.

she does stretch a lot (not side sucking in, clearly in pain stretching), but she also has that shoulder issue still and is a heavy sleeper. so that could be her being my lazy girl lol.

 

[coreline]

dshksdjghdfjkhgdfjk

Blue just had another recheck. the mass has STILL not grown, but it has changed shape a little. my vet is now pretty confident that it is not aggressive cancer. he thinks it feels like it's behaving more like an infectious mass and if it is cancer, it may be able to be de-bulked.

so because this has been a giant back and forth, Blue is back on for surgery rofl.

we just had cheerios in celebration <3

 

[coreline]

lol ok, so I feel like this is the biggest flip flop post of info ever ~

basically, what happened is that we made our "official decision" based on that it was still possibly aggressive cancer. when my vet said he no longer felt it was aggressive cancer, it basically all changed.

this has been the biggest roller coaster ever for me D:

 

[Joanne]

Well, that's good news then that it doesn't seem like aggressive cancer!

 

[mamarat]

I agree it's good it's not cancer.

 

[coreline]

:joy:

there are not enough dancing smileys to convey my joy right now :mrgreen:


Blue went in for surgery today and I was petrified! but my vet was able to remove the mass and when he opened it, it was obviously an abscess!

she went through surgery well, but I still can't pick her up for another couple hours. I am going to be paranoid until I have my Blue back home.

 

[SQ]

Great News !!

 

[Joanne]

That's wonderful news! I hope she recovers quickly.

 

[jorats]

That is the best news!!!

 

[coreline]

she's home finally and is not a happy rat. but who could blame her? hehe

it was apparently a pretty darn large abscess with tendrils that attached to the kidney, soft tissue, etc. as it's source for feeding it.

so the next couple days will likely be rough, though my vet is confident that he got as much out as could be removed (mostly the tendrils causing the problem).

my poor Blue, too many surgeries! (this is her third in the year I've had her)