Bleeding from Rectal/Vaginal Area: SDA or owner paranoia?

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Steerpike

Active Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
43
Location
cbs, NL
Hey!

Yesterday I arrived home to find that one of my rats, a 2yr 7month old female had died. She was the healthiest and most energetic of my rats (most of whom are starting to slow down and one of which has an inoperable tumour). She was lying with her head over the side of the entrance to one of her huts. There was no sign of having choked, no cuts or obvious injuries.
The only thing wrong was that there was some blood on her hind legs (not much) as though she'd bled either rectally or vaginally. One of her eyes also looked a bit jellied, in comparison with the other, but that may simply have been one of the other rats chewing it or maybe it was just something that happened post mortem.
Due to feeding issues while I'm not home (I have to feed several of my sick rats soft/fatty foods) I separate my CN. Dingo was alone with my rat Delilah, who is also fairly healthy.

When I was cleaning out the cage, I found some blood-stained bedding in the litter in the upstairs portion of the cage (where Dingo hadn't been). There wasn't much, but it had me concerned. Today while I had the rats out, I noticed there was blood on top of several things they'd climbed on, but I have no idea which rat was bleeding, as none of them had cuts or staining on their fur at all.
They do tend to get a bit quiet fairly quickly these days, due to old age, but Dotty and Delilah (two otherwise active rats) became quiet very suddenly and went to lie down. I noticed there was some blood on the white hammock Delilah chose to nap it (again, a very, very tiny amount, but fresh). I've examined her several times, only finding a bit of discolouration on some fur around her vaginal/rectal area.

I checked on the ratshack first to see if I could find anything, and ran into a thread on SDA, which mentioned the rats bleeding rectally before they died. I noticed some of the symptoms were to do with porphyrin staining around the eyes, etc.

Last week I took four of my rats (Webster, Chloe, Lola and Dotty) to the vet. Dotty had two cysts and a mammary tumour removed, Lola was perfectly fine, Webster was diagnosed with PT and Chloe has an inoperable mass in her abdomen and I was told just to keep her comfortable.
One of Chloe's symptoms has been an occasionally porphyrin -stained eye, which was bulging a bit today. It's an off-and-on thing and made me think she had PT as well (this is actually what I thought she had when I brought her to the vet, but he said even if she did have it she would die of the abdominal mass before it happened).

I'm now super-paranoid that my rats may have SDA, but I wanted to check here first. I touched them to make sure they weren't cold, which they weren't. This morning two of them were sneezing though. Webster has had a poor respiratory system throughout this whole ordeal with PT, but is taking baytril.

Should I be concerned about SDA or are these are likely to do with my ratties' other illnesses??
 
It doesn't sound like SDA to me, that is typically bulging eyes that can become lacerated, and a cervical (neck) swelling, plus unwellness and respiratory issues. Sounds like you are dealing with possible genital myco infections or uterine issues, and the vagaries of old age.
 
Have you had any new rats come into your house lately?

Are there males in this group? how many are bleeding, that you have actually seen blood on? You can sometimes spread open the vaginal area and see if they are bleeding vaginally. Are they having soft or watery stools? I know there is a huge outbreak of salmonella running through the animal world.
 
That's good to know!

I examined them for neck swellings and there were none on any of them (Dingo didn't have anything like that either). They're all seeming pretty happy at the moment. I'll keep my eye on them anyhow just in case, but what you say sounds sensible.

Thanks for your help!
 
hopefloats said:
Have you had any new rats come into your house lately?

Are there males in this group? how many are bleeding, that you have actually seen blood on? You can sometimes spread open the vaginal area and see if they are bleeding vaginally. Are they having soft or watery stools? I know there is a huge outbreak of salmonella running through the animal world.

I did take in my friend's rat, Arya recently. She was one of the ones who sneezed this morning, though otherwise she seems fine. It was a couple of weeks ago now that I took her in (she had to do her quarantine outside of my house, as I only have one rat room available to me). I don't have any males.

The only two with bleeding that I've seen that has been on a rat has been Dingo (the rat who died). Delilah has some staining, but it might not be blood.

Arya (the new rat) has had a lot of problems with diarrhoea, but I chalked that up to the dietary change, especially as it seems to be improving now. None of the others have had loose stools.
 
As lilspaz68 said:

lilspaz68 said:
It doesn't sound like SDA to me, that is typically bulging eyes that can become lacerated, and a cervical (neck) swelling, plus unwellness and respiratory issues. Sounds like you are dealing with possible genital myco infections or uterine issues, and the vagaries of old age.

This means a vet apt asap and antibiotics asap to treat any infections.
This is not something to put off.
 
That is good, however, it sounded like the bleeding is new and if any have developed an infection, antibiotics (etc) would be needed if they are not already on antibiotics.

(Sensitive topic for me since Lydia started bleeding, was put on antibiotics but went into shock from blood loss and died over the weekend before it was possible to get her spayed as no vets were able to do a spay during the weekend. So I would still suggest a vet visit if vaginal bleeding.)
 
I'm feeding them Sun Seed Critter Cubes (mushed up with water+baby food+olive oil at the moment, as some of them are sick/old). They also get fresh vegetables and the sick ones have nutri-cal in the morning (just a small amount).

None of them had loose stools except Arya, and hers is clearing up (she had the same problem when she was living with my friend and my friend switched her food, so I'm almost positive it's that).

All my rats are sleeping comfortably now, but I took Delilah out for another look earlier and she seemed fine. Strangely though, I did find some more blood in the cage (fresh, and again, not very much). There's no sign of blood on any of them and I haven't given any of them anything red to eat.

I'll definitely make an appointment, but I want to make sure I know who it is who's bleeding first, so he sees the right rat. Most of them went to the vet last week and he gave them a full look over, but Delilah, Dingo and Arya didn't go in.

EDIT: Another thing: could this be related to having lice? I'm currently treating all of my rats for lice. They had there first treatment a week ago and will have their second next Wednesday.
 
I'm starting to wonder if it's Chloe. I found some blood stains in their litter box again, where Chloe, Lola and Webster all went to sleep this afternoon (I think because it was hot, as in my worry about SDA I turned the heating up). Again, there wasn't much, and it looked kind of watered down, like it may have been in her urine. If this is the case it would make sense why I found random bits of it around.
Chloe was examined last week and the vet found a mass in her abdomen. He told me it was inoperable and to keep her comfy and well-fed (which I have, and mostly she seems content, apart from occasional eye-problems and small bouts of lethargy). I'm wondering now if the blood is maybe blood in her urine that's being caused by the mass. ): If that's the case then the blood on Dingo may just have been coincidence, but it would make a lot more sense.
 
UPDATE: It's definitely Delilah. I woke up last night and she looked pained and was crunching herself up and then when I tried to pick her up to look at her she ran across the cage and urinated blood (I assume she urinated and it wasn't pouring from some other area).
My vet's booked up for today and tomorrow, but I'm going in as a walk-in when he's available. His appointments don't start until 5 today.
Is there anything I should do before then to help Delilah? She seems very quiet and dopey, so I'm worried that maybe she's weak from the loss of blood. I gave her some nutri-cal and turned the heat up.
The other rats all seem fine.
 
I agree with mamarat, keep her very hydrated and warm, if you have infant ibuprofen, you could give her some. If you have her weight lilspaz68 can help with the dosing.
 
She's looking good right now (cozy and warm in a hammock and sleeping soundly).

Unfortunately I don't have a car and there are no pharmacies close enough for me to walk to (oh Newfoundland!). I don't have metacam or infant ibuprofen; would ibuprofen pills crushed and mixed with water work if I measured it correctly? I have a few human pain killers, but all adult ones.

My sister did point out that it's possible Dingo (the rat who died) never did bleed, but that the little bit of blood on her legs was from Delilah crawling on her and peeing. This actually seems a lot more likely, and would make things make a bit more sense (although Dingo died suddenly, she had no signs of illness at all-- nothing like Delilah does now).

I think Delilah ate some of the baby food I put down (I keep it in the cage for my oldies and for Webster), so that should help her out, hopefully. I'll make sure to offer her water periodically, just in case. ):

I hope she's okay! She was fine until yesterday, seemingly.

Thanks so much everyone for the help! She's a healthy, energetic rat normally, so I hope that will help her out so she can get seen by the vet!
 
Poor old gal, must be pretty uncomfortable :( I hope she'll poor through that
 
She's been drinking, so that's good news! She was resting after her drink, but now she's curling up like she's in pain again. The pain definitely seems to subside when she pees.
 
After a long wait at the vet yesterday, I found out that she's anaemic (could be much worse!). She's being treated with medication now and will have to continue it for three to four months. She's going back on Monday to have more blood work done (I imagine to check to see if the medicine is helping). She's seemed much more normal/active already, after only two doses, though some of that may just be happiness to be home. :)
 
They did blood work on her?

It sounded like a UTI (urinary tract infection to me) which usually clear up quickly and easily with antibiotics and pain meds. Did they give you pain meds and antibiotics or at least antibiotics?
 

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