Tumor removal in high-risk rat -- need advice

[mandycoot]

My sweet spayed (at 3 months old) girl Hustle is now 25 months old. About a month ago I noticed a mammary tumor in front of one of her rear legs. Unfortunately that was also the day she started having resipiratory troubles. We decided to try to clear up the respiratory stuff so we could remove the tumor, however, after trying a number of different medications in combination (Baytril, doxy, zithro, steroids, bronchodilators) nothing is working and her respiratory infection seems to be steadily getting worse as her tumor steadily gets larger.

At this point it is a little smaller than one of those large marbles, and I'm worried that at this rate, it won't be more than another three weeks or so before it really starts impairing her walking. The vet says that it would be an easy removal, but for her risk factors -- she has a respiratory illness, she's obese, and has been in chronic renal failure for the last year.

I'd really like opinions of what I should do. I know many of you have dealt with many older rats. I am nearing the end stages of my first round of rats and am experiencing all this aging junk for the first time. :-\ I don't want to leave the tumor to grow too large for her to walk comfortably and so that it takes up too much of the blood supply. If I waited too long and it absolutely had to be removed at some point, it would be a much more difficult surgery than it would now. However, do I risk her dying under anethesia to give her a better quality of life and maybe some more months? Now that my roommate just lost a 10-month-old boy in surgery I'm frankly terrified, but I'm afraid of the consequences of this tumor.

For reference, here's a picture of my sweet girl

 

[Willow Bean]

I don't have any words of advice for you since I haven't had to deal with tumors yet, but I can offer words of encouragement. You are definatly in the right place to get help and advice. There are many people here who will be able to share their experiences and tell you how to progress with the situation. You little girl is beautiful and I wish you all the best and I know that there will be someone to help you here! :hugs: to you and :tumkiss: to Hustle!

 

[mandycoot]

Thanks for the encouragement. You're right, this is a great place for advice! I don't post here much but I do when I'm looking to get advice from Shelagh and Jo. Pulling out the "big guns" so to speak. :lol:

 

[lilspaz68]

How bad is her respiratory condition Mandy?

 

[jorats]

This is a tough one. Weird that the meds aren't doing much for the resp. issues. I wonder if it's mostly damaged lungs, it could also pulmonary abscesses if so then I doubt the tumour will outlive her so to speak.
Have you thought about a possible xray? Have you also tried Lasix and enalapril as her issues could be heart related? If so, again, surgery may not be the best thing.

Right now, I have a boy with a large tumour on his leg. When he first developed it, he was 30 months old and struggling with respiratory problems. Now he's 34 months old and his lungs are clear but the tumour is so large, I'm worried it's too much for him. But for me, if they have lung issues, then surgery is out of the question. But only because with my clinic, it's extremely expensive but my vet would do a tumour removal is she thought the tumour would end up overpowering the rat.

The tumour being still smallish, you might want to wait and see and hope her lungs improve.
What does your vet recommend?

 

[mandycoot]

Her respiratory issues are only moderate, it just seems for me that once they hit a certain age they never entirely go away. Seems that all my oldies get stubborn respiratory once they hit two or two and a half. :?

Right now neither my vet nor I want to chance doing the surgery. But he left it up to me and I'm scared of, in the end, not doing everything I can for my girl. She had x-rays and the heart looked good, as much as he could see of it, so we didn't try Lasix and enalapril, but I'm wondering now if we might not just because nothing else is working. I'm also going to try nebulizing again but this time with a quieter nebulizer so hopefully it won't scare her to death and countact any benefits she's getting.

 

[jorats]

About the nebulizing... don't put her in a container, if you can, hold her and hold the cup near her, she will get some benefit from that, the less stress the better at this point.

 

[Lise]

I had that problem of nebulizing making the rats worse as well from the stress, Mandy.

My solution now is to put them in my quarantine/hospital cage and cover it completely with towels overtop and put the nebulizer mist into there. They don't get it as concentrated, but they also don't stress out so it helps much more.

Beyond the respiratory issues, you could consult with your vet for more accurate info -- but I believe that being put under anesthetic can make existing renal failure worse... which is why we do not like to put CRF cats under anesthetic, and if we do have to we put them on an incredibly high rate of IV fluids. Which as far as I know is not an option in most practices for rats.

Regardless, it is of course your decision. But if you think you would be mad at yourself after if she didn't come through the surgery, then I wouldn't do it -- just enjoy her and love her for all the time you have left.

 

[mamarat]

I had a rat with kidney disease and my vet would not put her under either.

 

[SQ]

It took us a long time to discover what was wong with Caleb, we tried so many things, and his xray looked ok. After months, we finally discovered he had CHF. With the proper meds, his life greatly improved.

 

[mandycoot]

Thanks for your advice, everyone. I've never had a rat with a mammary tumor, so I've been freaking out about whether letting her continue with the tumor is a death sentence or not. I think rationally I already knew of many rats who lived many more months with tumors, but I've been scared that I'm not doing everything I can for my baby.

Everyone has confirmed what I've been feeling, that I definitely do not want to risk surgery. I think that at this point there's no harm in trying Lasix and enalapril either, since she's not responding to anything else. I will try nebulizing her without a chamber or in a carrier, too, and hopefully that will do some good.

Thanks again!