SubQ a dehydrated rat.

I'm curious about the butterfly needle. What about it is helpful? Is it that the butterfly gives you something to anchor your fingers on? I've obviously never done SQ injections before, but I would like to learn.

Godmother said:

I'm curious about the butterfly needle. What about it is helpful? Is it that the butterfly gives you something to anchor your fingers on? I've obviously never done SQ injections before, but I would like to learn.

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The needle is longer and stays in the skin more easily, but it is the long, flexible, tube that is the major advantage. It allows the rat to move around and struggle a bit without the needle coming out. You have to inject the sq liquids pretty slowly, to allow absorption so it isn't leaking out, and it is easy for regular needles to come out of the skin with even the slightest movements. They come in especially handy if you are doing it alone.

I find dehydration in a sick rat just makes them feel awful and they stop eating and drinking, so they often feel so much better after a sub-q. I use it for rats that need meds FAST! Like PT rats, and ill rats that need the meds in their system quickly. I never got a nebulizer because I had the option of sub-q...with 2 people its dead easy (I use the hip skin as its the thinnest spot...just roll the skin between your fingers to find it). Its a bit harder for one person but can be accomplished as well, but then I usually use the scruff instead. You can also mix in your combo of meds into the Ringers Lactate solution for just the one shot. I also prefer this for respiratory rats where you cannot get oral meds into them and nebulizing would be too stressful.

These are my fixin's...and yes the butterfly needles are more expensive but they are worth it.

I'm jotting all this info down.

jorats said:

I'm jotting all this info down.

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Do you want me to post How I do it? I can do that easily

lilspaz68 said:

jorats said:

I'm jotting all this info down.

Click to expand...

Do you want me to post How I do it? I can do that easily

Click to expand...

i don't know about others but i would personally love it if you would.

Okay we will use the example of a PT rat. We will use dexamethasone and gentocin with the RLS. Its better to get Ringer's than just plain saline and a bag doesn't cost much at all.

1) Pull out all your fixin's. In this case the bag of Ringers Lactate Solution, the vials of meds, the smaller syringes, the larger syringe, and the butterfly needle (still packaged)
2) I use a 3 cc needled syringe to draw up the Ringer's, draw the plunger down to make 6room for the 2 other meds, then put the cap over the needle.
3) Then I use the 2 other smaller syringes to draw up the gentocin and the dexamethasone.
4) Pull out my butterfly needle, unwrap it, take the wee cap off the end, but leave the plastic cover over the needle itself. I then unscrew the cap of the 3 cc (needle inside) and "inject" the other meds into it.
5) Take your butterfly and screw the end onto the open end of the 3 cc syringe. Then I push the plunger down until the meds/RLS solution is just coming out of the needle of the butterly (cover still on).
6) The patient is either out right then, or you can go get them.
7) Remove the plastic cover on the butterfly needle and look at the needle itself, it is angled and you want the long side to be closest to your rat then using your fingers you fold over the "butterfly" to hold it for insertion.
8 ) I put them in my lap usually and figure out a way to restrain them against my body, and controlling the front quarters is most important when you are doing this by yourself. I keep them pressed into my body, pull up the skin on the neck rather tight (you are piercing rather than pushing a needle through, easier on everyone with the skin tension). I am slightly up from parallel to the skin when I push the needle in firmly...Make sure you feel that little pop where you are now sub-q...and then let go of the tented skin, grasp your syringe and gently start pressing down on the plunger and push the fluid under the skin. Some rats hate that feeling and may try to move or struggle...others do nothing. Once the fluid is in, remove the needle quickly and give your rat a treat :mrgreen:

I had some rats who would stay very still but as soon as that needle was out they were rampaging for their Yogie...I only fed yogies after sub-q. :cheeky:

Typing this out took a heckuva lot longer than it takes to do.... :nod:
I can also take pics of the various bits if needed...besides the actual injection, since no one needs it and I need both hands for rat holding/injections.

Thanks! Photos would certainly help. This is something that we all need to learn to do.

I did what I could, being just me with only so many hands :roll:

Smaller syringe for meds

3 cc syringe (these are just what I have right now) and RLS bag

3 cc syringe with cap/needle on

3 cc syringe with cap/needle off, and you can see where you can screw the butterfly tubing connection into..

butterfly needle and tubing

The connection end you screw into the syringe

The angle on the butterfly needle (long side goes into rat first)

How to hold the "butterfly" before insertion

Skin tent on back of shoulders (I insert into the side myself, others pinch the skin and do it between their fingers...

Hip skin tent...use your arm to pin the rat as well as you can, I also bend over them


Thank you to Faline my ratty model. :mrgreen:

Awesome pics Shelagh!
I just thought i would throw it out there that Different coloured Butterflys donote different Gague needles (the smaller the gague the bigger the needle - a 19g leaves a bigger hole than a 21g needle).

Also that not all syringes have the nice little luer lock that Shelagh shows (where to screw the Buttefly onto the syringe) the non-luer lock syringle will still work, the butterfly just wont be on there as secure as it would be with a luer lock.


They are small little points but i thought it was worth adding so that if someone was doing SQ fluids on a picture by picture basis they wouldn't get confused

I use 23 or 25 gauge needles myself but had no clue about the colour coding. Learn something new every day :thumbups:

Shelagh, where can you get 23 - 25 gauge needles?

jorats said:

Shelagh, where can you get 23 - 25 gauge needles?

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I get them from my vet. Kat has found a place you can order from in the US...these are 23-25 guage butterfly needle sets.

Sweet!

thanks

you can also get nice "blue" winged 21G butterflies if you have a larger rat to give fluids to. I've always found when im teaching a client how to give SubQ fluids at home on a kidney cat or any sick pet that describing the place where you inject like a tent door works well. You grasp the skin on the scruff and make a "tent" then you place the needle where the "door" would be so you can avoid going straight through the skin(and out the other side). Great pictures BTW!!!

I find even the 23 g needles are often too big for rats, I prefer 25 g myself

I have used blue ones, orange ones and even pink ones

moonhippie said:

you can also get nice "blue" winged 21G butterflies if you have a larger rat to give fluids to. I've always found when im teaching a client how to give SubQ fluids at home on a kidney cat or any sick pet that describing the place where you inject like a tent door works well. You grasp the skin on the scruff and make a "tent" then you place the needle where the "door" would be so you can avoid going straight through the skin(and out the other side). Great pictures BTW!!!

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That's exactly how I do my cat every day. :thumbup:

I too prefer 25 gage butterfly needles and would use 27 gage if I could get them.
Anything larger then 25 gage (smaller the #, the larger the gage) would be too large for me to feel comfortable having anyone insert into my ratties.